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#1 Jul 12, 2018 9:02 pm

Expat
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Free speach

Well I was always under the impression it was one of the fundamentals of American life, and was revered almost more than anything else.

But it seems it is only free if it aligns with the Government. If you protest the National Guard may come along and terminate your protest. Permanently.

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#2 Jul 13, 2018 5:50 am

Slice
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Re: Free speach

All I can say on this is, there are limits.

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#3 Jul 13, 2018 9:40 am

New Historian
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Re: Free speach

And who sets those limits? It can't be free speech if there's limits, can it? It's like being sort of pregnant.

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#4 Jul 13, 2018 11:08 am

Real Distwalker
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Re: Free speach

New Historian wrote:

And who sets those limits? It can't be free speech if there's limits, can it? It's like being sort of pregnant.


So, it isn't justice if there isn't perfect justice, there isn't liberty unless there is perfect liberty, it isn't democracy unless it is perfect democracy, there are no rights unless they are perfect rights and nobody is free unless they are perfectly free.

Nah, 'perfect' shouldn't be the enemy of 'very good'.



I don't know what event Expat was talking about in the original post but you can rest assured their protest wasn't broken up for what they said but for whatever the hell they were doing.  The right to free speech isn't a right to be disorderly, violent, threatening or to trespass.

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#5 Jul 13, 2018 2:25 pm

Expat
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Re: Free speach

Kent University... Vietnam War, and they were doing very little before 4 of them were killed.... one of them was just walking between classes.

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#6 Jul 13, 2018 2:30 pm

Real Distwalker
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Re: Free speach

Kent State was the action of trigger happy grunts.  It was maleficence.  It wasn't planned,  government policy or meant to suppress speech for heaven's sake.

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#7 Jul 13, 2018 2:37 pm

Expat
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Re: Free speach

Yes, but every last one of those grunts had been issued with live rounds. You don't put the army on a demo with live rounds unless there is a likelihood that they will be used.Night sticks can be bad enough.

Not only that, but it was only because of the intervention of one of the Lecturers begging the student to leave who by which time were sitting down, that the army that had given them 5 minutes to disperse didn't just massacre the lot of them.

Who knows these same grunts might have been saved from serving over seas because of the civilian protests?

Last edited by Expat (Jul 13, 2018 2:39 pm)

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#8 Jul 13, 2018 6:09 pm

Real Distwalker
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Re: Free speach

Again, the point wasn't to prevent them from speaking their minds.  They expected the protesters to engage in burning, destroying, and throwing rocks at police.  They throw rocks.

I am not defending the National Guard here.  They were as wrong as they could be.  My point is that the premise of your argument that Kent State was a case of the government setting out to suppress speech based on the content of that speech is wrong.

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#9 Jul 13, 2018 6:31 pm

Expat
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Re: Free speach

OK, granted it was not the speech, but in various protests at that time the police or who ever it was at that time at that event were extremely heavy handed. Even when it was just chanting and banner waving.

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#10 Jul 13, 2018 6:32 pm

Real Distwalker
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Re: Free speach

No doubt.

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