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#1 Sep 29, 2020 9:40 am

Expat
Active

Johnson and Johnson

Are starting stage 111, and looking for 60,000 sacraficial lambs.

Who is going to be stupid enough to take that chance?

The Australians have a nose spray thingy that is supposed to be 99.5% effective at preventing you catching the thing, and is broad spectrum, which is going into trials.

It's just what we've been looking for, a preventative which uses the "NATURAL" method of being used via the mucosa, instead of the unnatural method injecting into the body which creates an inflamatory response.

RD mentioned to nasal spray a few posts back.

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#2 Sep 29, 2020 9:43 am

Real Distwalker
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

Expat wrote:

Who is going to be stupid enough to take that chance?

Heroes who deserve respect, admiration and reward, not derision.

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#3 Sep 29, 2020 12:06 pm

Expat
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

Given the piss poor control mechanisms used, the misrepresentation of results, the inability to sue the companies, and the previous abysmal failures, previously as well as this current fiascos, anyone who throws themselves on the alter of experimentation at this stage is a dick.

Even some of those studies recently where they used Macac(sp) monkeys. Firstly they were YOUNG monkeys, so just like humans do not present with many if any symptoms, secondly the animals are known not to have bad rections to SAARS regardless, so it is a bogus experiment.

Just as the Astro Zenica trials where they pre tested the immune reponse of ALL the sample, and did not have a placebo element to the trial until ICAN kicked butt. Plus the Oxford trials had a couple of negative reactions, which they claim were not due to the vaccine, yet if you take the sample msize and the number of poor reactions, it was well outside the normal population expression of that illness, plus it is not unheard of for vaccines.... I can't recall which one/ones to bring on MS, but it is recognised data.

These trials are mostly bullshite, as they are using YOUNG HEALTHY PEOPLE. The group which needs protection, and needs the results to be balanced is OLD and INFERM PEOPLE. So when all the young chickens have a mild to no reaction, it don't prove nothing.

Finally unless they really have got their act together, it won't be the vaccine process that causes the problem, it will be when susceptable people, which is people with a genetic weakness, and those who are medically crippled get the actual virus they will go into immune system meltdown and die like flies.

You already mentioned the Nazal spray thing from Australia, which uses the immune system the way it is intended to work, it sounds like a brilliant methodology, which could stop people getting ill in the first place.

The vaccinnes will not stop you from getting it, they may reduce your symptoms, but if you were young and healthy you probably would not have had any symptoms in the first place, so getting no symptoms when you wouldn't have had any in means it's a bloody waste of time.

Also my understanding is while it may reduce symptoms, it does not stop transmission.. WTF use is that.

You do recall live experimentation was banned after the Nazis right?

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#4 Sep 29, 2020 12:25 pm

Real Distwalker
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

Were the British men who went over the top at the Somme and died by the thousands also dicks?   I mean, that was pretty dangerous, right? 

For the record, testing it on 60,000 brave volunteers is precisely, specifically, exactly an example of the control mechanism you say is lacking.   Also, they aren't using only "young, healthy people".  They are using a sample that represents a demographic cross section.

Yes, yes.  We get it.  You are an anti-vaxxer.  So don't volunteer to be a test subject.

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#5 Sep 29, 2020 1:04 pm

Real Distwalker
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

"People who are always taking care of their health are like misers, who are hoarding a treasure which they have never spirit enough to enjoy."

— Laurence Sterne

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#6 Sep 29, 2020 4:55 pm

Real Distwalker
Active

Re: Johnson and Johnson

Expat wrote:

Also my understanding is while it may reduce symptoms, it does not stop transmission.. WTF use is that.

Nothing keeps the virus from entering your body once you are immune. 

I had chickenpox when I was a child and am immune.  That doesn't mean that I haven't had the virus in my body dozens of times over the last 50 years.  It means my adaptive immune system recognizes it and eliminates it before it can make me sick.  I don't become contagious because the virus is eliminated before it can reproduce in transmission quantities.

So, by your definition I have had chickenpox dozens of times but only had symptoms the first time?   That is ridiculous.

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#7 Sep 29, 2020 5:09 pm

Expat
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

Real Distwalker wrote:

Were the British men who went over the top at the Somme and died by the thousands also dicks?   I mean, that was pretty dangerous, right? 

For the record, testing it on 60,000 brave volunteers is precisely, specifically, exactly an example of the control mechanism you say is lacking.   Also, they aren't using only "young, healthy people".  They are using a sample that represents a demographic cross section.

Yes, yes.  We get it.  You are an anti-vaxxer.  So don't volunteer to be a test subject.

What a friggin stupid analogy. The poor bastards that faced the Germans over the trenches ..... No maybe not so stupid.... The first wave of those poor bastards My GRANDFATHERS among them, thought they were going on a jolly outing that would last 2 weeks and they would be home for Christmas. Very similar to the bollocks that these volunteers are about to face. They know jack shit about what they are up against.

After the first waves, the enlisted men did their duty, and were killed and blown up time and time again being reburied bit by bit in that stinking, chlorine gas wafted, rat infested mortuary they called the trenches.

No don't do that stupid dismissive shit, it's the same as the Media, and the Big Pharma are doing. You have a friggin brain use it.

I am no more an anti vaxxer than anyone else, but I am not scared shitless by the bollocks the Big Pharma and it's cohort are putting out.

If you weren't trying to be a smart arse, and simply watched enough of the information readily out there instead of the concoction being presented by the powers that be you wouldn’t be such a smug piece of shit.

All the information is out there, it is not some magically made up load of misinformation from fantasists that have an alternative agenda, it's taken from  Official websites, like the CDC, WHO, NIH, it's lifted from the Lancet, and BMJ, its pucka shit, not twisted crap to fool the morons. This is why they are able to take various bodies to court and win case after case.

Get your head out of your arse and actually watch and listen. I am not a total friggin idiot, I watch the stuff I am telling you about, and from day one when I first located the Highwire I said.... no friggin way that is bollocks, but as the explanations roll in, the citations from genuine sources are presented unless you like sticking your head in the sand you have to accept the vast majority of it is true.

Or you could sit on the sidelines pouring scorn look at frig all and be an arsehole indefinitely.

The statements from these people are clear. "we are not antivaxxers, we are pro safe vaccinations". Just as I jumped on what seems to be a bloody good method of increasing immunity with that nasal method.

As for testing 60.000 heroes, if they don't have at least 30,000 people additionally tested with saline it is a totally invalid exercise. Up until now, at which point they have been directed by the courts to do the tests properly, the bloody companies have not been using completely neutral saline tests, they have been injecting a supposedly safe set of pathogens... don't ask me what from the top of my head I don't remember, but it wasn't a true blind placebo test, it was skewed.

These are the same criminals that made agent orange and reinvented it for our crops. They are no different from the Tobacco companies that for decades told us straight to out face that smoking was safe, when they knew 100% It wasn't.

Hasn't history taught you anything. FFS.

I have not yet turned up definititve information to dismiss what you wrote, but what makes you think they are going to trial it on 60 plus age people when they know people over 60 have weak immune systems... That could be murder. Think FFS.

Also they aren't able to find all these heros in America, they also have to locate them in Mexico and Brazil for starters.

Last edited by Expat (Sep 29, 2020 5:24 pm)

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#8 Sep 29, 2020 5:16 pm

Expat
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

Real Distwalker wrote:
Expat wrote:

Also my understanding is while it may reduce symptoms, it does not stop transmission.. WTF use is that.

Nothing keeps the virus from entering your body once you are immune. 

I had chickenpox when I was a child and am immune.  That doesn't mean that I haven't had the virus in my body dozens of times over the last 50 years.  It means my adaptive immune system recognizes it and eliminates it before it can make me sick.  I don't become contagious because the virus is eliminated before it can reproduce in transmission quantities.

So, by your definition I have had chickenpox dozens of times but only had symptoms the first time?   That is ridiculous.

You get the disease by natural means you develop immunity. In the case of Measles I think it is, when girls get it, they have the avaibility to pass on that immunity to their children when they are at their most vulnerable stage.  But with a vaccination this immunity is NOT passed on to the child.

As for Chickenpox, just wait Shingles is round the corner waiting for you. It killed my Stepdaughter.

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#9 Sep 29, 2020 6:47 pm

houston
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Re: Johnson and Johnson

That seems a bit off.
Does Dr Bergman have an easy solution for Island Fever?

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#10 Sep 29, 2020 8:23 pm

Real Distwalker
Active

Re: Johnson and Johnson

1) The Somme is a perfect analogy.  Both cases are people taking a risking their lives for the greater good.

2) Half the 60,000 are getting the vaccine, half are getting a placebo.

3) No shingles for me.  I have had the two part vaccination for shingles. 

4) You can get immunity by suffering through the disease or you can get immunity by being vaccinated.

5) You sound like a flat-earther referencing all the flat-earther literature you research proving the earth is flat.

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