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#1 Mar 01, 2022 10:07 am

Slice
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WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

America just loves their animals, especially dogs and cats. If a pet owner takes their pet to see a vet, and it is determined that the pet is sick and, in some cases, have cancer and no matter what kind of treatment is given that pet, will succumb to its illness.  The vet and pet owner quickly makes the decision to put that animal to sleep permanently.  They say it is not right to make that animal suffer.  Put the animal out of it misery.

My question is why can't that same principle apply to humans?

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#2 Mar 01, 2022 10:14 am

Real Distwalker
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

I think that the answer people would give is that a dog's quality of life is based on comfort and little else.  Further, a dog has no ability to contemplate its own mortality.  A dog is either in pain or not.  When they are put down the pain ends. There are no other considerations.

Humans, on the other hand, are sentient.  They know their own mortality.  They understand that death as an alternative to pain is more than lack of pain.  It is the end of life.  It is the end of experience.  It is to leave the company of loved ones.  It is death. Unlike a dog, I human can choose to endure the pain in exchange for more life.

That really isn't my concern, however.  I fear the slippery slope.  Today we are euthanizing at your request because your cancer is terminal, there is no hope for survival and your future is nothing but suffering.

Then, time passes, we get used to this and 25 years later we are killing people against their will because they have Downs Syndrome or are depressed.  It can happen and that is what worries me.

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#3 Mar 01, 2022 11:13 am

New Historian
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

Real Distwalker wrote:

I think that the answer people would give is that a dog's quality of life is based on comfort and little else.  Further, a dog has no ability to contemplate its own mortality.  A dog is either in pain or not.  When they are put down the pain ends. There are no other considerations.

Humans, on the other hand, are sentient.  They know their own mortality.  They understand that death as an alternative to pain is more than lack of pain.  It is the end of life.  It is the end of experience.  It is to leave the company of loved ones.  It is death. Unlike a dog, I human can choose to endure the pain in exchange for more life.

That really isn't my concern, however.  I fear the slippery slope.  Today we are euthanizing at your request because your cancer is terminal, there is no hope for survival and your future is nothing but suffering.

Then, time passes, we get used to this and 25 years later we are killing people against their will because they have Downs Syndrome or are depressed.  It can happen and that is what worries me.

Disagree entirely that dogs only know comfort and pain - dogs are every bit as emotional and sentient as humans - sometimes more so. I've seen dogs cry, laugh, express joy and sadness - does that sound familiar? Oh yes, they can even talk as well, just that we don't listen. When my precious Buddy got poisoned by licking a toad in Barbados, it was his auntie Fuggy who woke us up, distress clearly in her voice. When Rookie got run over, the other two were distressed for days, wouldn't eat. That's not sentient?

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#4 Mar 01, 2022 11:32 am

Real Distwalker
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

New Historian wrote:

Disagree entirely that dogs only know comfort and pain - dogs are every bit as emotional and sentient as humans - sometimes more so. I've seen dogs cry, laugh, express joy and sadness - does that sound familiar? Oh yes, they can even talk as well, just that we don't listen. When my precious Buddy got poisoned by licking a toad in Barbados, it was his auntie Fuggy who woke us up, distress clearly in her voice. When Rookie got run over, the other two were distressed for days, wouldn't eat. That's not sentient?

I don't disagree.  Let me see if I can express myself more clearly.   When a dog is suffering he doesn't know that the suffering isn't permanent.  The dog lives in the moment.  The suffering dominates his life.  All of life is suffering.

Here is what a dog is not able to do.  A dog cannot say, "I am suffering but I am willing to endure this suffering in order to extend my life.  I know the rest of my life is pain, but I can stoically endure it in exchange for the extension of of existence."

What that poor dog knows is that he is in pain.  He doesn't know why.  He doesn't know that it will continue.

For the record, no person loves his dog more than I love mine.  She is a big dog and she will be nine years old this month.  I have had to start to contemplate that her time is getting short.  That causes me great grief.  She feels like a soul mate who understands me utterly. I love her.

That said, I will refuse to keep her alive if all that remains for her is pain and suffering. I will give her an exit from that.

Now, having said that, if it was one of, say, my adult children it would be a radically different calculation.  Humans are different.  They can contemplate trading pain for life in a way an animal cannot.  They understand the trade off.   Further, human life has a value that is greater than animal life.

Should no one be allowed to choose to die with dignity?  I am not saying that.  I am saying that we shouldn't be putting down people they way we put down dogs.  And again, I stand in second place to no one in terms of love for my dog.

Last edited by Real Distwalker (Mar 01, 2022 11:36 am)

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#5 Mar 01, 2022 11:36 am

Real Distwalker
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

My 100 pound good girl.


20210124-105214.jpg

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#6 Mar 01, 2022 3:08 pm

New Historian
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

Sweet shaggy girl!

Agreed 100%. There's nothing worse than owners who keep pets living in pain and misery, because THEY can't bear to be parted. I believe in self-decided voluntary euthanasia, totally. Put me in a room, set up the injection, leave the room, and I'll do the rest.

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#7 Mar 01, 2022 7:59 pm

Wide Sargasso Sea
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

I love dogs and horses and that has always been a fact! When I die dog shelters will get some of my investments. Shit, they are better than humans who have become selfish and dour bastards!

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#8 Mar 02, 2022 9:21 am

Slice
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

I kinda get RDs long term plan, if you give them an inch, they most likely would take a yard.  Still if there is no hope, folks should be given that choice.

None ah allyu don't really know how dogs feel and tink.  Allyu  just guessing.

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#9 Mar 02, 2022 1:58 pm

New Historian
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

"None ah allyu don't really know how dogs feel and tink.  Allyu  just guessing."

Not true - he told me what he thinks, right there!! smile


Man-an-dawg.jpg

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#10 Mar 02, 2022 4:29 pm

houston
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Re: WHEN ANIMALS ARE TREATED BETTER THAN HUMANS.

Funny how guys seem to have better relationships with thier dogs than they do with their spouses.
My Chelsea passed away last year at the grand age of 16. She slowed down a bit but was as sprite as she was at age 2.
I don’t think I could ever replace her with another dog.

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